diff --git a/.github/workflows/buildLoadup.yml b/.github/workflows/buildLoadup.yml
index 537851886..eca862e61 100644
--- a/.github/workflows/buildLoadup.yml
+++ b/.github/workflows/buildLoadup.yml
@@ -124,6 +124,8 @@ jobs:
       # Checkout latest commit
       - name: Checkout Medley
         uses: actions/checkout@v4
+        with:
+          submodules: true
 
       # Setup release tag
       - name: Setup Release Tag
@@ -191,18 +193,6 @@ jobs:
         env:
           GITHUB_TOKEN: ${{ secrets.MAIKO_TOKEN }}
 
-      # Checkout Notecards and tar it in the tarballsdir
-      - name: Checkout Notecards
-        uses: actions/checkout@v4
-        with:
-          repository: ${{ github.repository_owner }}/notecards
-          path: ./notecards
-      - name: Tar notecards into tarball dir
-        run: |
-          mv ./notecards ../notecards
-          cd ../notecards
-          git archive --format=tgz --output="${TARBALL_DIR}/notecards.tgz" --prefix=notecards/ main
-
       # Install vnc
       - name: Install vnc
         run: sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install -y tightvncserver
diff --git a/.github/workflows/doHCFILES.yml b/.github/workflows/doHCFILES.yml
index 2d37f7c07..ecfb8fd9f 100644
--- a/.github/workflows/doHCFILES.yml
+++ b/.github/workflows/doHCFILES.yml
@@ -51,33 +51,8 @@ jobs:
 
       - name: Checkout Medley repo
         uses: actions/checkout@v4
-
-      - name: Checkout maiko
-        uses: actions/checkout@v4
-        with:
-          repository: ${{ github.repository_owner }}/maiko
-          path: ./maiko
-
-      - name: Checkout notecards
-        uses: actions/checkout@v4
-        with:
-          repository: ${{ github.repository_owner }}/notecards
-          path: ./notecards
-
-      - name: Checkout loops
-        uses: actions/checkout@v4
-        with:
-          repository: ${{ github.repository_owner }}/loops
-          path: ./loops
-
-      - name: Checkout test
-        uses: actions/checkout@v4
         with:
-          repository: ${{ github.repository_owner }}/test
-          path: ./test
-
-      - name: Cleanup .git for notecards, loops, test
-        run: rm -rf ./notecards/.git ./loops/.git ./test/.git
+          submodules: true
 
       - name: Download Maiko
         run: |
diff --git a/.gitignore b/.gitignore
index 9d7492cde..0523537cc 100644
--- a/.gitignore
+++ b/.gitignore
@@ -5,9 +5,6 @@ tmp/*
 # releases directory
 releases/*
 
-# maiko directory
-maiko/
-
 
 # all PDFs (those explicitly checked in aren't ignored
 # normally when you have derived files, you ignore them from git
diff --git a/.gitmodules b/.gitmodules
index e69de29bb..413826f62 100644
--- a/.gitmodules
+++ b/.gitmodules
@@ -0,0 +1,20 @@
+[submodule "maiko"]
+	path = maiko
+	url = https://github.com/Interlisp/maiko
+	branch = master
+[submodule "notecards"]
+	path = notecards
+	url = https://github.com/Interlisp/notecards
+	branch = main
+[submodule "loops"]
+	path = loops
+	url = https://github.com/Interlisp/loops
+	branch = main
+[submodule "test"]
+	path = test
+	url = https://github.com/Interlisp/test
+	branch = master
+[submodule "online"]
+	path = online
+	url = https://github.com/Interlisp/online
+	branch = main
diff --git a/loops b/loops
new file mode 160000
index 000000000..8508dd0d9
--- /dev/null
+++ b/loops
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Subproject commit 8508dd0d9af4b237c4f18c05d6655fefc621dfa3
diff --git a/maiko b/maiko
new file mode 160000
index 000000000..d791b1d33
--- /dev/null
+++ b/maiko
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Subproject commit d791b1d3323a6d15accb67f99485255e95868f66
diff --git a/notecards b/notecards
new file mode 160000
index 000000000..32defaee1
--- /dev/null
+++ b/notecards
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Subproject commit 32defaee14bc67e6a3f5d4979c8752c559d769ac
diff --git a/online b/online
new file mode 160000
index 000000000..9ae1f1308
--- /dev/null
+++ b/online
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Subproject commit 9ae1f1308846608c41d402f3b5a44cd48c0286ef
diff --git a/scripts/make-gh-pages.md b/scripts/make-gh-pages.md
index a38080854..96f7d58e4 100644
--- a/scripts/make-gh-pages.md
+++ b/scripts/make-gh-pages.md
@@ -5,17 +5,19 @@ HCFILES writes in {MEDLEYDIR} but it should write in something like (SRCDIR)
 
 ## Remove extraneous files
 
-There are lots of ways to get there but basically set up the execution environment with everything clean but notecards loops, test are copied in. If you don't make fresh, at least 'git clean'.
+There are lots of ways to get there but basically set up the execution environment with everything clean. If you don't make fresh, at least 'git clean'.
 
 ```
-gh repo clone interlisp/medley
-gh repo clone interlisp/notecards
-gh repo clone interlisp/loops
-gh repo clone interlisp/test
+git clone --recurse-submodules https://github.com/Interlisp/medley
+```
+
+Or, if you already have a clone:
 
-cp -r notecards loops test medley
-rm -rf notecards/.git loops/.git test/.git
 ```
+git submodule update --init --recursive
+```
+
+This will populate notecards, loops, test (and maiko) inside the medley directory.
 
 # making the .pdfs and index.html files
 
@@ -62,6 +64,5 @@ after you've done this, you can clean up (from the medley folder):
 ```
 find . -iname "*.pdf" -exec rm {} \;
 git remote set-url --push https://github.com/Interlisp/medley
-rm -rf loops notecards test
 ```
 
diff --git a/test b/test
new file mode 160000
index 000000000..9f6d26f71
--- /dev/null
+++ b/test
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Subproject commit 9f6d26f7194d8648b39d98d44fb21565120fd7d4